Um… a therapist is more selfish and petty and demanding then the angst riddle modern society?
GOT is only way people relate now?
Modern psychology and mythical archetypes can work wonders but you have to be able to flow them and that’s just too much for any mortal. She’She’s crewed?
I dunno. A combination of the three?
I don’t watch the show, but I believe there is quite a large cast of characters. Is he intending to listen to her problems and then compare it somehow to the problems of one of the show’s characters, and then recommending that she do what they did?
If she’s not familiar with the show, then suggesting to do whatever Cersei Lannister (or whoever) did to elevate her issues won’t help her.
Maybe. I dunno.
Perhaps in the past therapists and their patients would all have a good knowledge of Greek myths and legends (and history) or the Bible or Shakespeare or similar long-established set of situations, characters and characteristics to draw on for illustration and example – Judas, Solomon, Lady Macbeth, Romeo and Juliet, Narcissus, Aphrodite and so on. Nowadays people are less likely to have such a shared cultural background and in recent years the therapist has taken to using the next best universal reference: the people and settings in Game of Thrones. However, this woman cannot be helped as she perversely (like me, in fact) has apparently not seen it and is thus stuck out in some sort of cultural Outer Darkness, shivering in the howling winds. For her, winter is coming!
Maybe that is her issue, that she doesn’t know Game of Thrones and it makes her feel bad?
Well really an intense fan of anything could get to the point of referring all sorts of experiences to the lens of their fandom subject area. This illustrates some of the ways it can become excessive – – invading one’s professional space for instance.
Darmok.
It’s “Pardon My Planet.” I no longer think the cartoonist writes his dialogue in a last-minute panic. I now think he writes it thinking, “Okay, what would make the least amount of sense here…”
Maybe he uses the GoT characters as his therapeutic metaphors. “You’ve been taking a Cersei approach to life, when perhaps you should channel your inner Daenerys…”
Oh, and there is a LOT of ammo for therapy in the Cersei/Jaime relationship. Those two could make Freud say, “Oh, zat is just not right…”
The psychologist is obsessed with Game of Thrones. That’s it.
@Powers, I wonder what you meant by that…?
I think the artist’s intent is to say that EVERYBODY watches Game of Thrones, and EVERYBODY wants to talk about it at some point or another, whatever the situation.
And if you happen to be one of those poor souls that has never seen Game of Thrones, well… you’re beyond help.
Darmok. By the sea. With a dragon.
Winter is coming.
Robb Stark at the Red Wedding when the knives came out.
I’m not much of a fan of fantasy, although some lighter works (Discworld) or occasional urban stuff is okay. But “high fantasy” never was appealing. I like science fiction, especially non-MilSF space opera.
When I was in college, all my friends got into Tolkien. In spite of their insistence, I was uninterested. I was reading Niven and HHGttG. I did learn enough by osmosis to fake a LotR discussion.
Now when people try to get me interested in GoT, I tell them I already went through that when the discussion of the books (A Song of Ice and Fire) was all the rage on rec.arts.sf.written. So, no, I’m not investing in the TV series.
I’ve just been ‘introduced’ to Tom Holt’s oeuvre [he’s also a Brit, BTW], and found it markedly likeable and comparable to the DiscWorld series, but not enough to be comsidered ‘stolen from’, as so many think of Rowling’s works. Some quotes:
“New technology is useful, but it’s inefficient and ugly; it knows it’ll be obsolete by lunchtime tomorrow, so it has no incentive to be anything else.”
“Everything is out there if you know how to find it, and have the patience. I don’t and haven’t, but that’s my problem.”
“Luck, like a Russian car, generally only works if you push it.”
Sounds a bit Pratchettian, no?
I plan to read more of his works . . . luckily, there are quite a few of ’em.
@Andréa: Yes, Tom Holt is rather prolific, even before counting “K. J. Parker,” under which name he’s published another twenty or so non-humorous sf/f titles. He’s also done at least six non-fantastical (but, among other things, often humorous); five set in Classical Era Greece or Rome, all of which I recommend, and the sixth (MEADOWLAND) a “Vikings in North America” novel I’ve not yet read. Details at http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?1607
Well, this should keep me busy for a few weeks – THANKS for the recommendations!
I’m not sure James Pollock is correct in interpreting this comic, but at least he’s added some humor.
People think Rowling stole from Pratchett?
“People think Rowling stole from Pratchett?”
Um, what?
That’s weird as Pratchett and Holt are far more similar than Rowling and Pratchett which aren’t similar at all.
I began reading a book yesterday whose main character is a ‘seamstress’ who belongs to the ‘Guild of Seamstresses’ . . . now, tell me THAT isn’t straight from DiscWorld (and today I rec’d a notice from DiscWorld Emporium that a Seamstresses’ Guild stamp has been released, but that’s just a personal synchronicity. Oh yeah, the book I am reading was published in 2015, WAAAAAY after DiscWorld was ‘founded’.
I think what started the Rowlings vs Pratchett thing was the ‘Unseen University’, which trains wizards on DiscWorld, and the university that trains wizards (sorry, forgot its name) in the HP books.
The complaint I’ve heard is that Rowling stole from Gaiman (Books of Magic). I don’t agree, but I can see it.
I feel like “secret school for magic” is too generic to trigger accusations of stealing.
A little here, a little there, and suddenly, you have a popular series that outsells the originals.
Jane Yolen has darkly hinted that she feels her 1991 WIZARD’S HALL may also have been a Rowling “inspiration.”
But there are a lot of pre-Rowling stories about magic schools or about training kids up to be wizards;
the list here is certainly incomplete
as failing to note (among others) Merlin’s lessons to “Wart” in T.H. White’s THE SWORD IN THE STONE, and the earliest “school for learning magic” story I know of (admittedly this one is for evil magicians only) “The Devil’s Debt” by James Platt, in his 1894 collection TALES OF THE SUPERNATURAL.
Shrug: When asked about the idea that Rowling stole from Gaiman’s “Books of Magic,” Gaiman said he didn’t think she stole anything, and if there was any stealing going on, it was just that they both stole from T. H. White.
Ursula LeGuin had a snarky comment about the idea “how cute! It’s a book about a school to learn to be a Wizard” that I thought was fairly funny.
This seems more on par of the Pratchett/Rowling sniping. I pretty much have to agree claims of “subverting” fantasy and not thinking of Harry Potter as fantasy were pretty condescending and patronizing.
I would urge anyone not familiar with her to read Diana Wynn Jones.
I’ll second lark’s suggestion, with the addition that I think her finest book (and one of the funniest ones I’ve read and reread in recent decades) is her TOUGH GUIDE TO FANTASYLAND.
” I pretty much have to agree claims of “subverting” fantasy and not thinking of Harry Potter as fantasy were pretty condescending and patronizing.”
I don’t think so. It just shows that Ms. Rowling had a mental image of “fantasy” that included a different subset of stories. If, for example, your image of “fantasy” revolves around strange places and faraway lands, then a story set right where you live wouldn’t fit the category (in your mind). If your mental image of “fantasy” includes swords-and-sorcery in the forgotten times before civilization, then HP wouldn’t be fantasy, even though it features both sword and sorcery.
I bet the makers of Star Trek didn’t think they were making fantasy, either, but they were (are).
It was always fairly clear to me that those particular remarks were either blowing smoke to distance herself from the genre ghetto (understandable but annoying; one would hope that someone with her stature and influence would instead use that influence to break down the genre ghetto)… or alluding to plans she might have had that she ended up not following through with, e.g. the evil Dumbledore theory.
It’s highly unlikely that she hadn’t already read a wide range of fantasy herself when she started on Harry Potter. It’s not uncommon for mainstream writers to try to write a fantasy novel without knowing anything about it, and not only does it never come out well but it’s always blatantly obvious why.
“(understandable but annoying; one would hope that someone with her stature and influence would instead use that influence to break down the genre ghetto)”
There is no way to break down the genre ghetto. Westerns are westerns and mysteries are mysteries, and you can write a brilliant SF western mystery romance and westerns will continue to be westerns and mysteries will continue to be mysteries, because all the OTHER writers are trying to write for established markets. There are a few writers who are popular enough to build a sufficient cachet around their names to have an audience follow them whatever they choose to write… Ms. Rowling being one of them… but even they tend to have bigger success when they service the market(s) that made them popular in the first place. That’s the direction their publishers will push them. And if most of their money is coming from Hollywood… well, there still are a few vanity projects that get made, but there’s a reason there’s new Potterverse films coming out, and new Marvel movies coming out, and new supernatural serial-killer movies coming out… that reason is $$$. Hollywood wants to make more movies just like the one that made a bunch of movies last week.
‘ . . . just like the one that made a bunch of movies last week.’
made a bunch of money last week?
James, you’ve missed the point again.
When she felt threatened by genre crap Rowling could have said, instead of “oh it’s not really fantasy”, something more like “yes of course it’s fantasy and here is some other fine fantasy you shouldn’t be overlooking”.
I’m reasonably sure the Hogwarts gamekeeper emeritus appeared before book 6 and that interview.
Comics I Don't Understand 
Um… a therapist is more selfish and petty and demanding then the angst riddle modern society?
GOT is only way people relate now?
Modern psychology and mythical archetypes can work wonders but you have to be able to flow them and that’s just too much for any mortal. She’She’s crewed?
I dunno. A combination of the three?
I don’t watch the show, but I believe there is quite a large cast of characters. Is he intending to listen to her problems and then compare it somehow to the problems of one of the show’s characters, and then recommending that she do what they did?
If she’s not familiar with the show, then suggesting to do whatever Cersei Lannister (or whoever) did to elevate her issues won’t help her.
Maybe. I dunno.
Perhaps in the past therapists and their patients would all have a good knowledge of Greek myths and legends (and history) or the Bible or Shakespeare or similar long-established set of situations, characters and characteristics to draw on for illustration and example – Judas, Solomon, Lady Macbeth, Romeo and Juliet, Narcissus, Aphrodite and so on. Nowadays people are less likely to have such a shared cultural background and in recent years the therapist has taken to using the next best universal reference: the people and settings in Game of Thrones. However, this woman cannot be helped as she perversely (like me, in fact) has apparently not seen it and is thus stuck out in some sort of cultural Outer Darkness, shivering in the howling winds. For her, winter is coming!
Maybe that is her issue, that she doesn’t know Game of Thrones and it makes her feel bad?
Well really an intense fan of anything could get to the point of referring all sorts of experiences to the lens of their fandom subject area. This illustrates some of the ways it can become excessive – – invading one’s professional space for instance.
Darmok.
It’s “Pardon My Planet.” I no longer think the cartoonist writes his dialogue in a last-minute panic. I now think he writes it thinking, “Okay, what would make the least amount of sense here…”
Maybe he uses the GoT characters as his therapeutic metaphors. “You’ve been taking a Cersei approach to life, when perhaps you should channel your inner Daenerys…”
Oh, and there is a LOT of ammo for therapy in the Cersei/Jaime relationship. Those two could make Freud say, “Oh, zat is just not right…”
The psychologist is obsessed with Game of Thrones. That’s it.
@Powers, I wonder what you meant by that…?
I think the artist’s intent is to say that EVERYBODY watches Game of Thrones, and EVERYBODY wants to talk about it at some point or another, whatever the situation.
And if you happen to be one of those poor souls that has never seen Game of Thrones, well… you’re beyond help.
Darmok. By the sea. With a dragon.
Winter is coming.
Robb Stark at the Red Wedding when the knives came out.
I’m not much of a fan of fantasy, although some lighter works (Discworld) or occasional urban stuff is okay. But “high fantasy” never was appealing. I like science fiction, especially non-MilSF space opera.
When I was in college, all my friends got into Tolkien. In spite of their insistence, I was uninterested. I was reading Niven and HHGttG. I did learn enough by osmosis to fake a LotR discussion.
Now when people try to get me interested in GoT, I tell them I already went through that when the discussion of the books (A Song of Ice and Fire) was all the rage on rec.arts.sf.written. So, no, I’m not investing in the TV series.
I’ve just been ‘introduced’ to Tom Holt’s oeuvre [he’s also a Brit, BTW], and found it markedly likeable and comparable to the DiscWorld series, but not enough to be comsidered ‘stolen from’, as so many think of Rowling’s works. Some quotes:
“New technology is useful, but it’s inefficient and ugly; it knows it’ll be obsolete by lunchtime tomorrow, so it has no incentive to be anything else.”
“Everything is out there if you know how to find it, and have the patience. I don’t and haven’t, but that’s my problem.”
“Luck, like a Russian car, generally only works if you push it.”
Sounds a bit Pratchettian, no?
I plan to read more of his works . . . luckily, there are quite a few of ’em.
@Andréa: Yes, Tom Holt is rather prolific, even before counting “K. J. Parker,” under which name he’s published another twenty or so non-humorous sf/f titles. He’s also done at least six non-fantastical (but, among other things, often humorous); five set in Classical Era Greece or Rome, all of which I recommend, and the sixth (MEADOWLAND) a “Vikings in North America” novel I’ve not yet read. Details at
http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?1607
Well, this should keep me busy for a few weeks – THANKS for the recommendations!
I’m not sure James Pollock is correct in interpreting this comic, but at least he’s added some humor.
People think Rowling stole from Pratchett?
“People think Rowling stole from Pratchett?”
Um, what?
That’s weird as Pratchett and Holt are far more similar than Rowling and Pratchett which aren’t similar at all.
I began reading a book yesterday whose main character is a ‘seamstress’ who belongs to the ‘Guild of Seamstresses’ . . . now, tell me THAT isn’t straight from DiscWorld (and today I rec’d a notice from DiscWorld Emporium that a Seamstresses’ Guild stamp has been released, but that’s just a personal synchronicity. Oh yeah, the book I am reading was published in 2015, WAAAAAY after DiscWorld was ‘founded’.
I think what started the Rowlings vs Pratchett thing was the ‘Unseen University’, which trains wizards on DiscWorld, and the university that trains wizards (sorry, forgot its name) in the HP books.
The complaint I’ve heard is that Rowling stole from Gaiman (Books of Magic). I don’t agree, but I can see it.
I feel like “secret school for magic” is too generic to trigger accusations of stealing.
A little here, a little there, and suddenly, you have a popular series that outsells the originals.
Jane Yolen has darkly hinted that she feels her 1991 WIZARD’S HALL may also have been a Rowling “inspiration.”
But there are a lot of pre-Rowling stories about magic schools or about training kids up to be wizards;
the list here is certainly incomplete
http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/tag.cgi?1211
as failing to note (among others) Merlin’s lessons to “Wart” in T.H. White’s THE SWORD IN THE STONE, and the earliest “school for learning magic” story I know of (admittedly this one is for evil magicians only) “The Devil’s Debt” by James Platt, in his 1894 collection TALES OF THE SUPERNATURAL.
https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/011225521
Shrug: When asked about the idea that Rowling stole from Gaiman’s “Books of Magic,” Gaiman said he didn’t think she stole anything, and if there was any stealing going on, it was just that they both stole from T. H. White.
Ursula LeGuin had a snarky comment about the idea “how cute! It’s a book about a school to learn to be a Wizard” that I thought was fairly funny.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/4732385.stm
This seems more on par of the Pratchett/Rowling sniping. I pretty much have to agree claims of “subverting” fantasy and not thinking of Harry Potter as fantasy were pretty condescending and patronizing.
I would urge anyone not familiar with her to read Diana Wynn Jones.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/8414691/Diana-Wynne-Jones-a-wizard-writer-whose-young-life-was-far-from-magical.html
I’ll second lark’s suggestion, with the addition that I think her finest book (and one of the funniest ones I’ve read and reread in recent decades) is her TOUGH GUIDE TO FANTASYLAND.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tough_Guide_to_Fantasyland
” I pretty much have to agree claims of “subverting” fantasy and not thinking of Harry Potter as fantasy were pretty condescending and patronizing.”
I don’t think so. It just shows that Ms. Rowling had a mental image of “fantasy” that included a different subset of stories. If, for example, your image of “fantasy” revolves around strange places and faraway lands, then a story set right where you live wouldn’t fit the category (in your mind). If your mental image of “fantasy” includes swords-and-sorcery in the forgotten times before civilization, then HP wouldn’t be fantasy, even though it features both sword and sorcery.
I bet the makers of Star Trek didn’t think they were making fantasy, either, but they were (are).
It was always fairly clear to me that those particular remarks were either blowing smoke to distance herself from the genre ghetto (understandable but annoying; one would hope that someone with her stature and influence would instead use that influence to break down the genre ghetto)… or alluding to plans she might have had that she ended up not following through with, e.g. the evil Dumbledore theory.
It’s highly unlikely that she hadn’t already read a wide range of fantasy herself when she started on Harry Potter. It’s not uncommon for mainstream writers to try to write a fantasy novel without knowing anything about it, and not only does it never come out well but it’s always blatantly obvious why.
“(understandable but annoying; one would hope that someone with her stature and influence would instead use that influence to break down the genre ghetto)”
There is no way to break down the genre ghetto. Westerns are westerns and mysteries are mysteries, and you can write a brilliant SF western mystery romance and westerns will continue to be westerns and mysteries will continue to be mysteries, because all the OTHER writers are trying to write for established markets. There are a few writers who are popular enough to build a sufficient cachet around their names to have an audience follow them whatever they choose to write… Ms. Rowling being one of them… but even they tend to have bigger success when they service the market(s) that made them popular in the first place. That’s the direction their publishers will push them. And if most of their money is coming from Hollywood… well, there still are a few vanity projects that get made, but there’s a reason there’s new Potterverse films coming out, and new Marvel movies coming out, and new supernatural serial-killer movies coming out… that reason is $$$. Hollywood wants to make more movies just like the one that made a bunch of movies last week.
‘ . . . just like the one that made a bunch of movies last week.’
made a bunch of money last week?
James, you’ve missed the point again.
When she felt threatened by genre crap Rowling could have said, instead of “oh it’s not really fantasy”, something more like “yes of course it’s fantasy and here is some other fine fantasy you shouldn’t be overlooking”.
I’m reasonably sure the Hogwarts gamekeeper emeritus appeared before book 6 and that interview.